@djc @BenRossTransit i can assure you both can make Jewish kids with strong identification and attachment to Israel feel pretty horrible! and also that Jewish kids (and adults) do not universally agree on either question. (a difficult thing in the US Jewish community now is that a large group who previously had squish mixed feelings about zionism are becoming polarized towards outright antizionism, which might make this passover worse than any proverbial thanksgiving.)